IMPORTANT UPDATE — NEW RESEARCH AVAILABLE
This subject has now been completely rewritten and expanded with additional research and evidence.
READ THE NEW UPDATED ARTICLE HERE: QUICK FACTS: DOES JOHN 17:5 PROVE JESUS WAS GOD BEFORE THE WORLD EXISTED?
OR CLICK ON IMAGE BELOW
A detailed Bible-study image examining John 17:5 and Jesus’ prayer concerning the glory he had with the Father before the world existed. The study asks whether this proves Jesus is God and considers the verse within the wider context of John 17.
Isaiah 42:8 and John 17:5 Examined
Research by Simon Brown
IMPORTANT UPDATE TO THIS OLDER RESEARCH
This is one of my older Bible-study articles, which I have now revisited and substantially updated.
The original article raised an important question concerning Isaiah 42:8 and John 17:5, but some of my earlier statements were too brief and went further than the biblical evidence itself established.
Rather than simply deleting my earlier research, I believe it is better to correct it openly and strengthen the argument by examining the passages more carefully in their proper contexts.
The question remains important:
DOES GOD GIVING GLORY TO JESUS PROVE THAT JESUS IS GOD?
Let us examine what the Bible actually says.
“MY GLORY I WILL NOT GIVE TO ANOTHER”
One passage frequently presented as evidence that Jesus must be God is Isaiah 42:8:
“I am Yahweh, that is My name; and My glory I will not give to another, nor My praise to idols.”— Isaiah 42:8
The argument is usually straightforward.
1. Yahweh says He will not give His glory to another.
2. Jesus speaks about receiving glory from the Father.
3. Therefore, Jesus must be Yahweh Himself.
At first glance, this may appear convincing.
But does Isaiah 42:8 actually say that God can never give glory to anyone else?
The context is extremely important.
READ THE WHOLE STATEMENT
Notice the final words:
“…nor My praise to idols.”
Isaiah 42 is contrasting Yahweh, the true God, with false gods and idols.
Yahweh will not surrender the glory and worship that belong uniquely to Him to idols.
This understanding of the passage is also reflected in traditional commentaries, which commonly connect Isaiah 42:8 with the rejection of idolatry and the transfer of worship due to Yahweh to graven images. (Bible Hub)
That is quite different from saying:
“God can never bestow any kind of glory upon another person.”
And we know this distinction matters because Scripture explicitly describes God giving glory to others.
JESUS HIMSELF RECEIVED GLORY FROM THE FATHER
Now consider John 17:5.
Jesus prayed:
“And now, glorify Me—You, Father, with Yourself—with the glory that I had with You before the world existed.”— John 17:5, BLB
This is sometimes combined with Isaiah 42:8 to argue:
Yahweh does not give His glory to another.
Jesus has glory with the Father.
Therefore Jesus must be Yahweh.
But there is an immediate problem with using the argument in that way.
Only a few verses later Jesus says something remarkable.
JESUS GIVES GLORY TO HIS FOLLOWERS
Jesus says:
“And I have given them the glory which You have given Me, so that they may be one, as We are one.”— John 17:22
Notice the direction of the glory:
THE FATHER → JESUS → THE DISCIPLES
Jesus says that the Father gave glory to him, and Jesus in turn speaks of giving glory to his followers.
Does that make the disciples God?
Obviously not.
Therefore, the mere fact that someone receives glory associated with God cannot by itself prove that the recipient is God.
John 17:22 is especially significant because commentators recognize that Jesus speaks of believers sharing in the glory associated with his own glorification. (Bible Hub)
BUT WE MUST BE CAREFUL HERE
My original article described the glory given to the disciples as necessarily being exactly the same glory in every respect as the glory mentioned in John 17:5.
That statement was too strong.
John 17:22 certainly says:
“the glory which You have given Me I have given them”
but we should not automatically assume that every reference to glory throughout John 17 has precisely the same meaning or function.
What we can establish is much simpler:
Receiving glory from God does not automatically make someone God.
That conclusion comes directly from the biblical evidence.
WHAT ABOUT MOSES?
My original article also mentioned Moses.
After Moses had been in the presence of Yahweh, Scripture tells us:
“And it came to pass when Moses came down from Mount Sinai… that Moses did not know that the skin of his face shone through His speaking with him.”— Exodus 34:29
Moses reflected something of God's glory so powerfully that his face became radiant.
Yet nobody would conclude:
MOSES MUST THEREFORE BE GOD.
This isn't an exact parallel with John 17:5, so we shouldn't pretend that it is.
But it illustrates an important biblical principle:
A human being can reflect or participate in glory originating from God without becoming God Himself.
JOHN 17:5 STILL PRESENTS AN IMPORTANT QUESTION
We must not avoid the most difficult part of John 17:5:
“…the glory that I had with You before the world existed.”
What does Jesus mean?
Traditional Trinitarian interpretation understands this as Jesus referring to personal glory that he literally possessed alongside the Father before creation.
Biblical Unitarians have offered a different interpretation: that Jesus is speaking of glory that already existed in God's foreknowledge, purpose and plan, and was therefore his before the world existed.
For example, BiblicalUnitarian.com argues for precisely this foreknowledge interpretation of John 17:5. (biblicalunitarian.com)
There are also interpreters who strongly reject that explanation and regard John 17:5 as evidence of Christ's personal pre-existence. (byustudies.byu.edu)
Therefore, we should acknowledge the real interpretive question rather than pretending John 17:5 is an easy verse.
But one thing is important:
ISAIAH 42:8 DOES NOT SETTLE THAT QUESTION.
John 17:5 needs to be examined from the wider biblical context.
SOMETHING ELSE HAPPENS JUST TWO VERSES EARLIER
Before Jesus asks for this glory, he says:
“And this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent.”— John 17:3
Look carefully at the distinction Jesus makes.
He addresses his Father.
He calls the Father:
“THE ONLY TRUE GOD”
and then distinguishes himself as:
“JESUS CHRIST WHOM YOU HAVE SENT.”
Then, two verses later, Jesus asks that same Father to glorify him.
Whatever interpretation we ultimately adopt concerning John 17:5, John 17 itself distinguishes Jesus from the Father to whom he is praying.
JESUS DOES NOT GLORIFY HIMSELF
This distinction appears elsewhere in John's Gospel.
Jesus said:
“If I glorify Myself, My glory is nothing. It is My Father glorifying Me…”— John 8:54
Again we have:
THE FATHER GLORIFIES JESUS.
This fits perfectly with Jesus' prayer:
“Father, glorify Your Son…”— John 17:1
The glory of Jesus is repeatedly connected with what the Father gives to him.
GOD ALSO GLORIFIES HIS PEOPLE
The New Testament goes even further.
Paul writes:
“…and whom He justified, these also He glorified.”— Romans 8:30
And:
“…if indeed we suffer with Him, so that also we may be glorified with Him.”— Romans 8:17
Christians can therefore be glorified with Christ.
Again, this obviously doesn't transform Christians into Almighty God.
It means God can bestow glory upon His servants and His children while remaining uniquely God.
SO WHAT DOES ISAIAH 42:8 ACTUALLY ESTABLISH?
Isaiah 42:8 declares the uniqueness of Yahweh:
“I am Yahweh, that is My name…”
Yahweh will not surrender the worship, praise and divine honour belonging uniquely to Him to false gods and idols.
That is the immediate context. (Bible Hub)
But this does not mean Yahweh cannot glorify His chosen servants.
And above all, it does not mean:
“Anyone whom God glorifies must therefore be God.”
The Bible itself prevents us from making that argument.
DOES ISAIAH 42:8 + JOHN 17:5 PROVE JESUS IS GOD?
No—not by that argument alone.
If someone wishes to argue that John 17:5 teaches Jesus personally existed before the creation of the world, that interpretation needs to be examined on its own merits.
But the argument:
“GOD DOESN'T GIVE HIS GLORY TO ANOTHER → JESUS RECEIVED GLORY → THEREFORE JESUS IS GOD”
is too simplistic.
Why?
Because Jesus himself says:
“The glory which You have given Me I have given them.”— John 17:22
And Scripture speaks of believers being glorified with Christ.
Therefore, receiving glory from God is not in itself proof that someone is God.
THE DISTINCTION REMAINS
Throughout Jesus' prayer we continue to see two identifiable parties:
THE FATHER
The One Jesus addresses as:
“the only true God.”
JESUS CHRIST
The One whom that God:
sent, loved and glorified.
Jesus does not pray to himself.
Jesus asks the Father to glorify him.
And Jesus says that the glory the Father gave him is also given to his followers.
None of this diminishes Jesus.
The Bible presents Jesus as the Christ, the Son of God, the one sent by the Father, the risen Lord and the appointed ruler through whom God brings salvation.
But we should allow Scripture to describe him using its own words rather than beginning with a theological conclusion and forcing every reference to “glory” to support it.
FINAL CONCLUSION
Isaiah 42:8 is a powerful declaration of Yahweh's uniqueness and His rejection of idolatry.
But it should not be turned into a statement the verse itself does not make.
God can—and according to Scripture does—give glory to others.
He glorified Jesus.
Jesus speaks of giving glory to his followers.
Believers will be glorified with Christ.
Therefore:
THE FACT THAT JESUS RECEIVES GLORY FROM GOD DOES NOT, BY ITSELF, PROVE THAT JESUS IS GOD.
John 17:5 raises the separate and important question of what Jesus meant by the glory he had with the Father “before the world existed.”
That deserves careful investigation in its own right.
And when we investigate it, we should remember the words Jesus had spoken only moments earlier:
“YOU, THE ONLY TRUE GOD, AND JESUS CHRIST WHOM YOU HAVE SENT.”
John 17:3
Our goal should never be to make the Bible conform to our theology.
OUR THEOLOGY SHOULD CONFORM TO THE BIBLE.
Research by Simon Brown
wwwrealdiscoveriesorg-simon.blogspot.com
COMMENT FROM THE ORIGINAL ARTICLE
The following comment from Sir Anthony Buzzard appeared beneath my original research and is preserved here as part of the history of this article:
“Yes, we all know that Christians are going to be glorified and as you well point out v 22, and 24 Jesus has already promised that future glory, and he promised it even before those to be glorified had been born!”
— Sir Anthony Buzzard www.restorationfellowship.org
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